At the end of the day whatever sports it is, its on players to get the basics right. MRF pace academy selected Sachin Tendulkar and Sourav Ganguly as budding pace bowler in early years ! Many graduate like Prashant Vaidya (had tremendous pace) , David Williams, Parash Mamre faded. But when Zahir, Nehra, Irfan started delivering it all happened. Similarly after 1996 WC when we got rid of Kambli, Manjarekar and infused the squad with Sourav, Dravid, Vikram Rathod (his performance was better than other two but could not find his footing in international matches) Indian batting line up started enjoying depth. Then our team was further reinforced by Yuvi, MSD, Zahir, Sehwag, VVS, Gambhir. So all I am trying to say is the format or infrastructure was there but cricket started to enjoy a supply chain of talent from 1996 onwards. Previously it was just like our football team one or two guys. In batting Azhar and Sachin, in bowling Kapil Dev and Srinath. Thats all. Occasional brilliance from Jadeja, Kambi, etc never helped to get the consistency or dominance. I addition to above, our youngsters started deliver in cricket. What I am trying to say is though we have had world's biggest star Sachin, we got success and dominance once we become a team. (Interested people may read John Wright's book where he wrote how he changed Indian's habit of heavy dinner to heavy breakfast and early to bed)
Sadly, in football we never had a perfect set of players who will carry an entire generation (In my life time, excluding PK, Chuni, Balaram, Rahim Sahab gen). It was always a good coach and a marquee sort of combination. During Sukwinder sing, he assembled a good team. But what happened to Jules Alberto, Godfrey Pereira, Khalid Jamil, Gawli who had tremendous potential? They cold not become like Sourav or Dravid. It was Bhaichung all alone after Vijayan's retirement. . RC Prakash, Raman Vijayan, Dipendu Biswas, Aseem Biswas, Paresh Shivalkar had tremendous success in NFL and cups but did not deliver at all in international arena. Alex Ambrose, Abhisek Yadav performed better in international matches who was subdued in domestic competition. Similarly now Sunil is alone and do not have Yuvi or MSD at his side. We still do not have a competent CM after Climax retired. Guys do you feel now what Edu Bedia was doing for FC Goa? Why is this not happening? Our youngsters are not having basics right. Not having three four consecutive forward passes or even square passes. Somehow it never happened. Do not know genetics or not but I feel its Indian habit. In our domestic league our players enjoy tremendous amount of time which is way behind than international standard. No of touches taken, turning all are slow. In ISL instead of increasing speed, foreigners too enjoying that extra touch and thats why once a foreigner comes to India simply does not leave India in his playing life (couple of exceptions are there but that proves the rule). Blame it on ISL or coaches, its our footballers who need to pull their socks up literally.
agree with @dhritiman7 on the pace of ISL, it was the reason that made everyone here believe that Bheke was the inevitable choice for NT before Asian cup 2019. and he was exposed badly after his induction in NT.
What I feel, Rahul Bhekes posture during his game like running style, hand position, composed look etc made us believe he is a complete side back. He is indeed a good player and hope will be a complete rock solid side back in near future. I also hope BFC utilize our youngsters more carefully. Udanta, Ashique, Suresh all are asset and wrong utilization of them has left an impression on their game. Ashique was never meant for LB. He is a good attacking LW. I wrote earlier in forum that coaches are making LWs to LB rather than trying to make a side back improving his attacking ability. It started with Subhak Bhowmik made Nabi a left SB where as he was fantastic in LW position with a right foot. He had ability to cut inside and pace, brave in the air and good crossing abilities. Could have been a fantastic replacement of Renedy but faded (before his head injury he was well below his game). Similar fate happened to Subhas Chakrabarty. Why I am skeptical about 3 - 5 - 2 or 3-4-3 is we need world class side backs or side halfs to play in that format who can be side back while defending and make the formation 5 - 3 - 2 and during attack an 3-5-2 or 3-4-3. Habas tried that with Soseiraj and Prabir with Rathi John Jonson and Pritam at center. But they had McHugh / Hernandez to hold back in case of counter attack. Also when your side backs or side halfs progress your attacking player needs to move inside to allow wide runner to stretch the field. I have been seeing Manveer / Bipin is just enjoying the space in the channel just above the opponent side back. How is Igor going to implement this format? We look scattered through out the game. It wont be easy for Indians to implement 3 back format. If really we need to go with that kind of formation I might pick - GSS Sana - Sandesh - Bose Mehta / Kotal Ashique / Mandar Borges / Apuia / Glan
Thapa Brandon
Rahul KP / Manveer Sunil
I kept Bose as I feel he is better in CB than as a LB. Sumit Rathi can replace him if he comes back to 1st XI. Mishra and Rai should be there on bench.
This @Kool guy is getting on my nerves now. He dosn't know jack shit about Indian football (or football in general) yet continues to sermonize everyone with long, vague posts which have no relevance in factual reality while giving example of other random sports! Just like AIFF! 😂 All the other members including me have followed Indian football for the last 10-15 yrs (I have been following Indian NT since 2007 while I was in lae school). We all know whats plaguing the Indian football and we give realistic opinions. Not this guy. Always some vague shit. He should first learn more about football, what is the domestic structure, which clubs are good, which players are promising, what did the previous coaches do right & wrong etc. Else its just irritating reading such vaguely framed long, winding posts! And to answer him about how Indian bowlers increased their pace compared to 90s - BCCI started the MRF Pace Academy in bangaluru which helps young bowlers to hone their skills. Every prospective bowler goes there to learn. Plus the domestic cricket structure in India is highly robust and competitive - Ranji trophy, Deodar trophy, U16 league, u19 league, various state tournaments. This gives even unknown players sufficient match experience. Plus we have some of the best coaches donestically who work on youngsters' techniques in the initial days itself.
And now this is an indian cricket forum Now we can extensively discuss how punjab u14's have beaten Korean national cricket team during their asian games preparation .
Igor Stamic said his team was batter then FC Goa, and his team qualified to next round while fc goa failed with 4 foreigners to qualify for next round, he also said allowing Afghanistan to dominated and score was all part of his strategy
@ ;dhritiman7 Thanks mate for detailed information. I like your articulation.
I thought of sharing similar points on cricket. But stopped as I don't want to drag the discussion. On top of it, don't have first hand information on older football generation
- if you do not know the basics of sports - you should keep your mouth shut - do not act as if you are a genius since you are following NT from whenever - who cares dude. Just saying final third and passing and change the coach does not mean u know anything about football. --- And to answer him about how Indian bowlers increased their pace compared to 90s - BCCI started the MRF Pace Academy in bangaluru which helps young bowlers to hone their skills. --- This statement shows how much you know about cricket and other sports. First stop acting as if you are a genius and start thinking what the other guy is trying to say. Also do your research before putting your mouth out in the open and make yourself look like a fool. Just becasue u like football - does mean you know everything about it. You have no clue what it takes to build a successful team in any sport. What is your educational qualification and any experience in sports related activity to what capacity - do nt say i am following IFN for 15 years. Have you read any reseach papers on any of the sports journals. Please start doing that for starters ... Before running your mouth all over ... learn the basic of sports and development and how to develop elilte athelets. Then you can comment on me.
So this guy @kool again wrote a long winding, vague post abusing me but not answering how am I wrong in my answer about Indian bowlers improving after 90s. Sure I mixed up MRF Pace Foundation (which is in chennai) with NCA (National Cricket Academy) started by BCCI in Bengaluru in 2000, but my point on how our bowlers improved remains the same. Both MRF & NCA focused on fitness, technique, diet of players to make them better. Heres an article on the contribution of MRF pace academy in improving Indian bowlers - https://i.stuff.co.nz/sport/cricket/106127074/how-indian-pace-bowling-was-transformed-by-a-school-for-quicks. When I say something, I say with facts, and not make vague statements. But sorry for diverting the discussion from the main topic. I apologise for that.
BTW the way forward for Indian football is the same one adopted for cricket - have more academies, strengthen the local leagues at state level, give players more playing time, have better coaches. In 2012 when AIFF started their 5 regional academies, it was a brilliant move. But today I don't any academy except the elite academy at Goa is working. One at Kalyani is still working? I dunno. But it should restart these academies. We need to catch our players in their early youth itself to give them proper technical training. There was also a plan for establishing a Footballing Centre of Excellence in Odisha. What became of that? We need that badly.
Elite academy was a good idea but developing players is not on federation . We only want them to create a system where youth teams can play all year around , not like 2 weeks and disappear whole year. Clubs should do their part , except Bengaluru and Goa no other ISL club is not even slightly bothered about their youth teams and are non exsistent. They have them for namesake just to get afc and national club license .
@Lord_Pessi Yeah what about the clubs ? . Except the above teams in ISL no other team is promoting from their second team. Their second team hardly plays and the clubs don't seem to care. Teams like Odisha who give an outward opinion as if they promote youth players, turns out they only sign young players for first team with just a chance of selling. How well is your youth team doing ? The other day I saw Hyd FC CEO brag about youth development. I am like dude yes you signed younger players kept the wage below. But how is that youth development ? I felt enraged and felt like punching the guy on the face. You have to nurture players from young and develop them or have a existing structure before bragging about it.
Comments
So all I am trying to say is the format or infrastructure was there but cricket started to enjoy a supply chain of talent from 1996 onwards. Previously it was just like our football team one or two guys. In batting Azhar and Sachin, in bowling Kapil Dev and Srinath. Thats all. Occasional brilliance from Jadeja, Kambi, etc never helped to get the consistency or dominance.
I addition to above, our youngsters started deliver in cricket. What I am trying to say is though we have had world's biggest star Sachin, we got success and dominance once we become a team. (Interested people may read John Wright's book where he wrote how he changed Indian's habit of heavy dinner to heavy breakfast and early to bed)
Sadly, in football we never had a perfect set of players who will carry an entire generation (In my life time, excluding PK, Chuni, Balaram, Rahim Sahab gen). It was always a good coach and a marquee sort of combination. During Sukwinder sing, he assembled a good team. But what happened to Jules Alberto, Godfrey Pereira, Khalid Jamil, Gawli who had tremendous potential? They cold not become like Sourav or Dravid. It was Bhaichung all alone after Vijayan's retirement. .
RC Prakash, Raman Vijayan, Dipendu Biswas, Aseem Biswas, Paresh Shivalkar had tremendous success in NFL and cups but did not deliver at all in international arena.
Alex Ambrose, Abhisek Yadav performed better in international matches who was subdued in domestic competition.
Similarly now Sunil is alone and do not have Yuvi or MSD at his side. We still do not have a competent CM after Climax retired. Guys do you feel now what Edu Bedia was doing for FC Goa?
Why is this not happening?
Our youngsters are not having basics right. Not having three four consecutive forward passes or even square passes.
Somehow it never happened. Do not know genetics or not but I feel its Indian habit. In our domestic league our players enjoy tremendous amount of time which is way behind than international standard. No of touches taken, turning all are slow. In ISL instead of increasing speed, foreigners too enjoying that extra touch and thats why once a foreigner comes to India simply does not leave India in his playing life (couple of exceptions are there but that proves the rule).
Blame it on ISL or coaches, its our footballers who need to pull their socks up literally.
I also hope BFC utilize our youngsters more carefully. Udanta, Ashique, Suresh all are asset and wrong utilization of them has left an impression on their game. Ashique was never meant for LB. He is a good attacking LW. I wrote earlier in forum that coaches are making LWs to LB rather than trying to make a side back improving his attacking ability. It started with Subhak Bhowmik made Nabi a left SB where as he was fantastic in LW position with a right foot. He had ability to cut inside and pace, brave in the air and good crossing abilities. Could have been a fantastic replacement of Renedy but faded (before his head injury he was well below his game).
Similar fate happened to Subhas Chakrabarty.
Why I am skeptical about 3 - 5 - 2 or 3-4-3 is we need world class side backs or side halfs to play in that format who can be side back while defending and make the formation 5 - 3 - 2 and during attack an 3-5-2 or 3-4-3. Habas tried that with Soseiraj and Prabir with Rathi John Jonson and Pritam at center. But they had McHugh / Hernandez to hold back in case of counter attack. Also when your side backs or side halfs progress your attacking player needs to move inside to allow wide runner to stretch the field. I have been seeing Manveer / Bipin is just enjoying the space in the channel just above the opponent side back. How is Igor going to implement this format? We look scattered through out the game. It wont be easy for Indians to implement 3 back format.
If really we need to go with that kind of formation I might pick -
GSS
Sana - Sandesh - Bose
Mehta / Kotal Ashique / Mandar
Borges / Apuia / Glan
Thapa Brandon
Rahul KP / Manveer Sunil
I kept Bose as I feel he is better in CB than as a LB. Sumit Rathi can replace him if he comes back to 1st XI. Mishra and Rai should be there on bench.
Now we can extensively discuss how punjab u14's have beaten Korean national cricket team during their asian games preparation .
Thanks mate for detailed information. I like your articulation.
I thought of sharing similar points on cricket. But stopped as I don't want to drag the discussion.
On top of it, don't have first hand information on older football generation
When I say something, I say with facts, and not make vague statements.
But sorry for diverting the discussion from the main topic. I apologise for that.
Yeah what about the clubs ? . Except the above teams in ISL no other team is promoting from their second team. Their second team hardly plays and the clubs don't seem to care. Teams like Odisha who give an outward opinion as if they promote youth players, turns out they only sign young players for first team with just a chance of selling. How well is your youth team doing ? The other day I saw Hyd FC CEO brag about youth development. I am like dude yes you signed younger players kept the wage below. But how is that youth development ? I felt enraged and felt like punching the guy on the face. You have to nurture players from young and develop them or have a existing structure before bragging about it.