On Vietnam & India comparison.. I want to be on neutral side.
@ ;ashindia & all IFN friends. not sure why most of the people referring to just 1 friendly against Vietnam. We won that game due to Chhetri's brilliance. During that time (Asian cup preparation), baring Namibia's game, we lost all other 4 Home friendlies ( 2 against Thailand, 1 against Hong Kong & Yemen). I'm not counting Kuwait, UAE & Iraq loses as they are away games and these teams are stronger than us. Just by 1 friendly , if we feel , we are superior to them, We managed to get a point against China, Oman & Jordan. Are we comparable to them ?
Whoever follows Asian football, knows Vietnam NT is not a good team in 2005-2015. But they did won against the likes of Qatar, UAE during that period (official games) including qualifying to QF in 2007 Asian cup (Joint hosts).
Their youth teams always better than us . Their current NT success is true reflection of their youth teams effectiveness. At U-16/U-17, we are comparable with them as both the teams are getting qualified to AFC U 16 cup. The main difference is starting from U-19 level. Starting from 2008, we never qualified for U-19 AFC cup where-as Vietnam qualified for all final events starting from 2010.
But Vietnam fate changed starting from 2016 AFC U-19 Championship. They are semi-finalists in that championship, their-by qualified for 2017 U-20 World Cup. Though they got just a point in World cup, they had lot of international exposure & their team confidence improved followed by success in 2018 AFC U-23 Championship & 2018 Asian Games.
@Nagendra I agree that Vietnam were always slightly better than India. But I don’t think the gap/quality difference was much between both. Vietnam struggled to dominate SEA, however last 3-4 years they have gone on to become much much better.
Vietnam has been doing very well over the last 5 years or so. Park Hang-seo is the kind of Asian coach, I would prefer for the coaching role for NT as well as ISL clubs. This is the kind of person who would be willing to stay back, watch the games, do coach education programs at grassroots level and scout for the players too (with the help of assistants). The main issue here could be the language barrier, but hey isn't football in itself a universal language!! ☺️
If we don't compare India against the likes of Vietnam, then there is no point in discussing about future & improvement of Indian football.
Both India & Vietnam has low budget in sports, infrastructure is not good, Quality wise, both the league are almost at same level.
Main difference is planning. 1. Vietnam also chased European/South American coaches till 2011. But they realized it will not work out for them and soon went with Vietnam coaches followed by Asian coaches. Current Head Coach is from South Korea , he is over-seeing U-23 team along with NT. 2. Though they don't have 8 month league, their league structure is proper and they do have domestic cup competition. 3. They have a proper channel to promote players from U-16 to U-19 to U-23. On top of it, Arsenal JMG Academy act as a feeder club to Hoang Anh Gia Lai . Most of Vietnam youth players prefer to play instead of warming bench.
On top of it, Vietnam has players who had exposure in foreign leagues 1. Dang Van Lam trained at top Russian academies, followed by stints in lower Russian league & Thai League. Now he is with J1 league club, Cerezo Osaka 2. Luong Xuan Truong had played in Korean & Thai league 3. Doan Van Hau : After his success with U 19 & U 23 teams, he had a loan Stint with SC Heerenveen (Dutch top tier)
No point of so much discussion honestly. Vietnam invested in grassroots just like we have done too, but their golden generation somehow stuck together and the same team core got success in U-19, then U-23 and has gone on to replicate this at Asian cup and now WC qualifiers. Couple attacking players play in Europe as well which is missing from our players. Their region also provides them slightly more competitive games in terms of competitions and friendlies. Similarly Jordan and Bahrain had a golden generation too between 2005-2015 which has now faded away
On the flip side, In Domestic level , we haven't improved in past few years and we are heading towards where exactly we started.
In I-League starting from 2009-10 till 2012-13 season , we had 14 teams with 4 foreign player rule ( 3 + 1 AFC). I League teams used to play 26 games + Federation cup & other domestic competitions.
Now after all the hype, FSDL/AIFF could not able to schedule at-least 6-7 month league and this would be 8th ISL season. Not concerned about no. of teams. Even with 11 team, they can schedule 6-7 month league with 3 legs (30 games) or 28 games ( 1st stage : 20 games with 11 teams, 2nd stage : Championship stage (5 teams : 8 more games) & Relegation stage ( 6 teams-5 or 10 games ) )
Along with AFC cup group stage, I league champions should be promoted to ISL. Their-by I league will have proper motivation till FSDL implement promotion/relegation.
Reliance has lot of money, if they are actually bothered about improvement of Indian football, they need to increase the sponsorship money of ISL & I-League, need to schedule league in effective way along with proper youth league. Reliance currently running academy for different age groups which is a good thing. AIFF/FSDL halted Indian football progress, with their proper will & planning, definitely they can put things in proper place.
Only progress we made is our NT defense improved and we got few players who can play 3-4 passes. But that is nothing to do with ISL/FSDL. We need to remember that, Dempo SC, East Bengal & BFC played well in AFC competitions when they are part of I-League.
Football development is not a well known entity for all of us. We just read about this country, that country and strat comparing. Let us take some sport that we are all very well aware - Cricket and do this discussion. This is just to keep in simple terms which we have all seen through our eyes from 80-90-2000-2010s upto 2021, Which is 50 years span after 83 WC win.
It does not matter what sport we are talking about right - the process is still the same, the path and learning and failures/success follow the same curves right. Remember those 89s,90,2000s - where our blowers were not able to knock the opposition - not even one bowler could bowl over 140+. Now suddenly how does India have one or two bowlers in each Ranji team clocking 140+. How was our Team India in 90,2000s. How is it now? What changes and how our performance has gone up while Pak, Sri, Bang, SA have gone down? If you could think through this and tell me the reasons - we could just apply the same logic to FOOTBALL am i Correct? The answer to FOOTBALL issues and questions and success lies in this. I will leave it for individuals to figure out. I am not here to teach anyone anything. PEACE ...
This @Kool guy is getting on my nerves now. He dosn't know jack shit about Indian football (or football in general) yet continues to sermonize everyone with long, vague posts which have no relevance in factual reality while giving example of other random sports! Just like AIFF! 😂 All the other members including me have followed Indian football for the last 10-15 yrs (I have been following Indian NT since 2007 while I was in lae school). We all know whats plaguing the Indian football and we give realistic opinions. Not this guy. Always some vague shit. He should first learn more about football, what is the domestic structure, which clubs are good, which players are promising, what did the previous coaches do right & wrong etc. Else its just irritating reading such vaguely framed long, winding posts! And to answer him about how Indian bowlers increased their pace compared to 90s - BCCI started the MRF Pace Academy in bangaluru which helps young bowlers to hone their skills. Every prospective bowler goes there to learn. Plus the domestic cricket structure in India is highly robust and competitive - Ranji trophy, Deodar trophy, U16 league, u19 league, various state tournaments. This gives even unknown players sufficient match experience. Plus we have some of the best coaches donestically who work on youngsters' techniques in the initial days itself.
- if you do not know the basics of sports - you should keep your mouth shut - do not act as if you are a genius since you are following NT from whenever - who cares dude. Just saying final third and passing and change the coach does not mean u know anything about football. --- And to answer him about how Indian bowlers increased their pace compared to 90s - BCCI started the MRF Pace Academy in bangaluru which helps young bowlers to hone their skills. --- This statement shows how much you know about cricket and other sports. First stop acting as if you are a genius and start thinking what the other guy is trying to say. Also do your research before putting your mouth out in the open and make yourself look like a fool. Just becasue u like football - does mean you know everything about it. You have no clue what it takes to build a successful team in any sport. What is your educational qualification and any experience in sports related activity to what capacity - do nt say i am following IFN for 15 years. Have you read any reseach papers on any of the sports journals. Please start doing that for starters ... Before running your mouth all over ... learn the basic of sports and development and how to develop elilte athelets. Then you can comment on me.
Comments
@ ;ashindia & all IFN friends.
not sure why most of the people referring to just 1 friendly against Vietnam. We won that game due to Chhetri's brilliance. During that time (Asian cup preparation), baring Namibia's game, we lost all other 4 Home friendlies ( 2 against Thailand, 1 against Hong Kong & Yemen). I'm not counting Kuwait, UAE & Iraq loses as they are away games and these teams are stronger than us.
Just by 1 friendly , if we feel , we are superior to them, We managed to get a point against China, Oman & Jordan. Are we comparable to them ?
Whoever follows Asian football, knows Vietnam NT is not a good team in 2005-2015. But they did won against the likes of Qatar, UAE during that period (official games) including qualifying to QF in 2007 Asian cup (Joint hosts).
Their youth teams always better than us . Their current NT success is true reflection of their youth teams effectiveness. At U-16/U-17, we are comparable with them as both the teams are getting qualified to AFC U 16 cup.
The main difference is starting from U-19 level. Starting from 2008, we never qualified for U-19 AFC cup where-as Vietnam qualified for all final events starting from 2010.
But Vietnam fate changed starting from 2016 AFC U-19 Championship. They are semi-finalists in that championship, their-by qualified for 2017 U-20 World Cup. Though they got just a point in World cup, they had lot of international exposure & their team confidence improved followed by success in 2018 AFC U-23 Championship & 2018 Asian Games.
Park Hang-seo is the kind of Asian coach, I would prefer for the coaching role for NT as well as ISL clubs. This is the kind of person who would be willing to stay back, watch the games, do coach education programs at grassroots level and scout for the players too (with the help of assistants).
The main issue here could be the language barrier, but hey isn't football in itself a universal language!! ☺️
If we don't compare India against the likes of Vietnam, then there is no point in discussing about future & improvement of Indian football.
Both India & Vietnam has low budget in sports, infrastructure is not good, Quality wise, both the league are almost at same level.
Main difference is planning.
1. Vietnam also chased European/South American coaches till 2011. But they realized it will not work out for them and soon went with Vietnam coaches followed by Asian coaches. Current Head Coach is from South Korea , he is over-seeing U-23 team along with NT.
2. Though they don't have 8 month league, their league structure is proper and they do have domestic cup competition.
3. They have a proper channel to promote players from U-16 to U-19 to U-23. On top of it, Arsenal JMG Academy act as a feeder club to Hoang Anh Gia Lai . Most of Vietnam youth players prefer to play instead of warming bench.
On top of it, Vietnam has players who had exposure in foreign leagues
1. Dang Van Lam trained at top Russian academies, followed by stints in lower Russian league & Thai League. Now he is with J1 league club, Cerezo Osaka
2. Luong Xuan Truong had played in Korean & Thai league
3. Doan Van Hau : After his success with U 19 & U 23 teams, he had a loan Stint with SC Heerenveen (Dutch top tier)
In Domestic level , we haven't improved in past few years and we are heading towards where exactly we started.
In I-League starting from 2009-10 till 2012-13 season , we had 14 teams with 4 foreign player rule ( 3 + 1 AFC). I League teams used to play 26 games + Federation cup & other domestic competitions.
Now after all the hype, FSDL/AIFF could not able to schedule at-least 6-7 month league and this would be 8th ISL season. Not concerned about no. of teams. Even with 11 team, they can schedule 6-7 month league with 3 legs (30 games) or 28 games ( 1st stage : 20 games with 11 teams, 2nd stage : Championship stage (5 teams : 8 more games) & Relegation stage ( 6 teams-5 or 10 games ) )
Along with AFC cup group stage, I league champions should be promoted to ISL. Their-by I league will have proper motivation till FSDL implement promotion/relegation.
Reliance has lot of money, if they are actually bothered about improvement of Indian football, they need to increase the sponsorship money of ISL & I-League, need to schedule league in effective way along with proper youth league.
Reliance currently running academy for different age groups which is a good thing. AIFF/FSDL halted Indian football progress, with their proper will & planning, definitely they can put things in proper place.
Only progress we made is our NT defense improved and we got few players who can play 3-4 passes. But that is nothing to do with ISL/FSDL. We need to remember that, Dempo SC, East Bengal & BFC played well in AFC competitions when they are part of I-League.
Football development is not a well known entity for all of us. We just read about this country, that country and strat comparing. Let us take some sport that we are all very well aware - Cricket and do this discussion. This is just to keep in simple terms which we have all seen through our eyes from 80-90-2000-2010s upto 2021, Which is 50 years span after 83 WC win.
It does not matter what sport we are talking about right - the process is still the same, the path and learning and failures/success follow the same curves right. Remember those 89s,90,2000s - where our blowers were not able to knock the opposition - not even one bowler could bowl over 140+. Now suddenly how does India have one or two bowlers in each Ranji team clocking 140+. How was our Team India in 90,2000s. How is it now? What changes and how our performance has gone up while Pak, Sri, Bang, SA have gone down? If you could think through this and tell me the reasons - we could just apply the same logic to FOOTBALL am i Correct? The answer to FOOTBALL issues and questions and success lies in this. I will leave it for individuals to figure out. I am not here to teach anyone anything. PEACE ...
And to answer him about how Indian bowlers increased their pace compared to 90s - BCCI started the MRF Pace Academy in bangaluru which helps young bowlers to hone their skills. Every prospective bowler goes there to learn. Plus the domestic cricket structure in India is highly robust and competitive - Ranji trophy, Deodar trophy, U16 league, u19 league, various state tournaments. This gives even unknown players sufficient match experience. Plus we have some of the best coaches donestically who work on youngsters' techniques in the initial days itself.
- if you do not know the basics of sports - you should keep your mouth shut - do not act as if you are a genius since you are following NT from whenever - who cares dude. Just saying final third and passing and change the coach does not mean u know anything about football.
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And to answer him about how Indian bowlers increased their pace compared to 90s - BCCI started the MRF Pace Academy in bangaluru which helps young bowlers to hone their skills.
---
This statement shows how much you know about cricket and other sports. First stop acting as if you are a genius and start thinking what the other guy is trying to say. Also do your research before putting your mouth out in the open and make yourself look like a fool. Just becasue u like football - does mean you know everything about it. You have no clue what it takes to build a successful team in any sport. What is your educational qualification and any experience in sports related activity to what capacity - do nt say i am following IFN for 15 years. Have you read any reseach papers on any of the sports journals. Please start doing that for starters ... Before running your mouth all over ... learn the basic of sports and development and how to develop elilte athelets. Then you can comment on me.